aristotle
Nov 13, 11:26 PM
Not quite. There are at least two other options. Fair use, and exhaustion/implied license/first sale doctrine.
The use is almost certainly fair use, and Apple's rights may very well be exhausted under the first sale doctrine. It's a thorny question of law since there is nothing in the Mac OS license that makes it clear what you can do with those icons. Apple would have been better off putting something in the development agreement about not being able to use representations of Macs, etc. But they didn't.
So your argument is that since a court of law would find this to be copyright infringement, it's covered by the development agreement.
My opinion, as an I.P. lawyer, is that it's not at all clear that it's copyright infringement, that most people would think it probably isn't, and that therefore the development agreement does not at all clearly forbid this sort of thing.
P.S.: You're saying developers just need to read the agreement. I'm saying they need to read the agreement, go to law school, and guess how Apple will interpret the facts.
Which law firm please. We'd all like to know for future reference, who to not trust our cases with. While most law has to do with the letter of the law, jury trials often are won or lost based on what the jury believes to be the intent or spirit of the law.
The british common law legal system was never intended to be like this. The lawyers have destroyed and twisted it beyond all recognition. It was originally supposed to be based on judeo-christian morals and ethics. There is not supposed to be a grey area. You are either deliberately infringing on the rights of others or you are not. The original intent was to have a court case as the last resort where parties would first try to solve the problem by talking to each other, then go to arbitration and then court as a last resort.
*Edit*
Screenshots on other sites show airflow displaying a Firefox icon. That icon is definitely not covered any implied license through use of the API on the mac. Care to explain that to us Mr. Lawyer?
The use is almost certainly fair use, and Apple's rights may very well be exhausted under the first sale doctrine. It's a thorny question of law since there is nothing in the Mac OS license that makes it clear what you can do with those icons. Apple would have been better off putting something in the development agreement about not being able to use representations of Macs, etc. But they didn't.
So your argument is that since a court of law would find this to be copyright infringement, it's covered by the development agreement.
My opinion, as an I.P. lawyer, is that it's not at all clear that it's copyright infringement, that most people would think it probably isn't, and that therefore the development agreement does not at all clearly forbid this sort of thing.
P.S.: You're saying developers just need to read the agreement. I'm saying they need to read the agreement, go to law school, and guess how Apple will interpret the facts.
Which law firm please. We'd all like to know for future reference, who to not trust our cases with. While most law has to do with the letter of the law, jury trials often are won or lost based on what the jury believes to be the intent or spirit of the law.
The british common law legal system was never intended to be like this. The lawyers have destroyed and twisted it beyond all recognition. It was originally supposed to be based on judeo-christian morals and ethics. There is not supposed to be a grey area. You are either deliberately infringing on the rights of others or you are not. The original intent was to have a court case as the last resort where parties would first try to solve the problem by talking to each other, then go to arbitration and then court as a last resort.
*Edit*
Screenshots on other sites show airflow displaying a Firefox icon. That icon is definitely not covered any implied license through use of the API on the mac. Care to explain that to us Mr. Lawyer?
Eidorian
Aug 28, 12:11 PM
http://guides.macrumors.com/Merom
billy_d_goat
Sep 1, 08:07 AM
Minor hardware upgrades, sure. But, a largescale hardware rollout, I doubt it. New Movie Store sounds great though!
And what is with all the drunk skunks in here?! :eek:
And what is with all the drunk skunks in here?! :eek:
bigmc6000
Mar 23, 05:33 PM
I don't know how much support I'm going to get for this but are we seriously going to sit around and blame only the drunk drivers for this? I mean, really. Our entire society aggrandizes the idea of having a beer and bars/restaurants go out of their way to make drinks that have gratuitous amounts of alcohol but don't taste like it and we're going to sit around and solely blame the person.
WTH is the accountability to bars? They say a bar can't serve you if you're drunk - mmhmm. I will guarantee you that the bar down the street only cares if you're too drunk to stand, they couldn't care less if you're above .08%. If people cared more about preventing DD and less about just trying to catch people who gave in to the temptation of alcohol we'd have a "taxi-tax." Each drink sold has a 5 cent tax - every bar in the area has to require people to blow before they leave and if they are above .08 they have 2 options - take a cab home (paid for by the taxi-tax) or sit around, drink water and wait until it's low enough for you to drive. I've been to a fair number of bars and I've had enough where I had to have a friend drive and I will tell you that not once in my entire adult life would I have given a crap if they charged me 5 cents more per drink. Even if it had to be 10 cents more per drink I'd be fine with that as well.
As I said, if this was about safety and not just trying to get people, put them in jail and take their money they'd do that but instead they do this, help the state budget but leave millions of lives at risk every single day...
WTH is the accountability to bars? They say a bar can't serve you if you're drunk - mmhmm. I will guarantee you that the bar down the street only cares if you're too drunk to stand, they couldn't care less if you're above .08%. If people cared more about preventing DD and less about just trying to catch people who gave in to the temptation of alcohol we'd have a "taxi-tax." Each drink sold has a 5 cent tax - every bar in the area has to require people to blow before they leave and if they are above .08 they have 2 options - take a cab home (paid for by the taxi-tax) or sit around, drink water and wait until it's low enough for you to drive. I've been to a fair number of bars and I've had enough where I had to have a friend drive and I will tell you that not once in my entire adult life would I have given a crap if they charged me 5 cents more per drink. Even if it had to be 10 cents more per drink I'd be fine with that as well.
As I said, if this was about safety and not just trying to get people, put them in jail and take their money they'd do that but instead they do this, help the state budget but leave millions of lives at risk every single day...
kgarchar
Oct 12, 10:45 PM
i'd buy it!
cere
Apr 14, 01:09 PM
Can you provide any indications that Intel is dropping support for Thunderbolt? Any reason to believe that PC makers won't provide USB ports like they do now but also DisplayPorts like they do now, only in both cases the ports are upgraded to support USB 3 and thunderbolt?
I think it is too early to really get a read one way or the other. I am hopeful that TB will take off. But this time I think it will be more the drive and peripherals vendors that will make or break it. If they can do a USB3 drive and it will work with any system that has USB3 and/or TB, why would the also do a TB version? I am not saying they won't, but there is certainly an incentive to drop the extra sku and investment that a TB version would require.
I think it is too early to really get a read one way or the other. I am hopeful that TB will take off. But this time I think it will be more the drive and peripherals vendors that will make or break it. If they can do a USB3 drive and it will work with any system that has USB3 and/or TB, why would the also do a TB version? I am not saying they won't, but there is certainly an incentive to drop the extra sku and investment that a TB version would require.
powerbuddy
Sep 5, 01:52 PM
9.99? you can rent movies from Mlink or Cinemanow for 4.99 or DVR's from 3.99. Just stupid if we dont keep to buy and keep the movie for that price.
ctdonath
Mar 22, 02:34 PM
How are you MBP owners liking your Thunderbolt port? Do you feel like someone with a DVD disk in 1975?
Having a host with that port makes it easier to get a device to match than the other way around. At most months until match-up instead of years.
Having a host with that port makes it easier to get a device to match than the other way around. At most months until match-up instead of years.
1984
Aug 23, 09:08 PM
Don't 90% or more of the MP3 players on the market also infringe this patent (including the forthcoming Zune). By making this payout Apple have given Creative the means to fight other companies (such as Microsoft, Sandisk, etc) which could tie them up for years and possibly even delay the launch of Zune. Meanwhile, Apple have their nice license agreement and can continue unabated...
The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
Dmac77
Apr 25, 12:03 AM
There's no such thing as being safe driving 25 above the limit. I'm not the type of person to slow people down, because that's not my business, but I am the type of person to laugh at someone who whizzes past me, then I pass 5 miles later getting written up. Just wait until your first ticket or accident, you'll reconsider your driving habits.
Technically I was only 20 over the limit (I'm in Michigan). Also, radar detectors are a great thing:)
EDIT: @mrsir2009 - no that lady was doing 5mph under the speed limit in the passing lane, while not even passing. Traffic in the right side lane was passing her. She then proceeded to brake check me and travel under 55mph (the posted minimum in Michigan). More like wtf is wrong with her.
-Don
Technically I was only 20 over the limit (I'm in Michigan). Also, radar detectors are a great thing:)
EDIT: @mrsir2009 - no that lady was doing 5mph under the speed limit in the passing lane, while not even passing. Traffic in the right side lane was passing her. She then proceeded to brake check me and travel under 55mph (the posted minimum in Michigan). More like wtf is wrong with her.
-Don
cmaier
Nov 17, 03:57 PM
Boom:
http://twitter.com/kickingbear/status/5803909520
To quote:
"Good question raised by Guy English: Why is it OK for the new Star Wars: Trench Run iPhone game to include this image of an iPhone, when many other apps, like for example Instapaper, have been rejected for including original icon artwork that merely resembles an iPhone?"
Boom. So what now apologists?
w00master
what? you expect consistency?
http://twitter.com/kickingbear/status/5803909520
To quote:
"Good question raised by Guy English: Why is it OK for the new Star Wars: Trench Run iPhone game to include this image of an iPhone, when many other apps, like for example Instapaper, have been rejected for including original icon artwork that merely resembles an iPhone?"
Boom. So what now apologists?
w00master
what? you expect consistency?
ezekielrage_99
May 1, 12:52 AM
I'm looking at getting a new iMac fingers crossed for the following:
- Bluray (I know... but it would be nice)
- Thunderbolt
- USB3
- AMD Radeon HD 67XX-68XX with up to 2GB RAM (it wont happen though :()
- Space for 2 HDD (I know, again it would be nice for two internal drives)
- i5 and i7.. Hopefully no i3 in the line up.
- Up to 24GB...
Again if I can't get an iMac with beefier video card it looks like another Alienware with Linux...
- Bluray (I know... but it would be nice)
- Thunderbolt
- USB3
- AMD Radeon HD 67XX-68XX with up to 2GB RAM (it wont happen though :()
- Space for 2 HDD (I know, again it would be nice for two internal drives)
- i5 and i7.. Hopefully no i3 in the line up.
- Up to 24GB...
Again if I can't get an iMac with beefier video card it looks like another Alienware with Linux...
mox358
Sep 4, 09:29 PM
There may be lots of TV options out there, but right now Apple isn't servicing any of them. They're losing potential business to 3rd Party companies like Elgato. If they released a simple box with analog/digital standard/hidef options, they would be servicing the overwhelming majority of the market (most digital, satelite and other special services require set-top boxes anyway).
I really doubt that Apple will put a TV tuner in this thing (if it's real). Think about it -
Point 1 - If Apple puts a tuner in then they have to deal with the myriad of different types of TV.
Point 2 - THEY SELL TV SHOWS!
Does Steve want you to Tivo the new episode of "The Office" on your "MediaMac/Airport Express Video/Super iPod" or does he want you to come to the iTunes store and download it for $2? Apple, despite most of our (including my own) beliefs is a business and they have to think of the $$$ first.
Why give something away when you can make money off it? That's still my theory as to why the mini didn't have a tuner from the start.
I really doubt that Apple will put a TV tuner in this thing (if it's real). Think about it -
Point 1 - If Apple puts a tuner in then they have to deal with the myriad of different types of TV.
Point 2 - THEY SELL TV SHOWS!
Does Steve want you to Tivo the new episode of "The Office" on your "MediaMac/Airport Express Video/Super iPod" or does he want you to come to the iTunes store and download it for $2? Apple, despite most of our (including my own) beliefs is a business and they have to think of the $$$ first.
Why give something away when you can make money off it? That's still my theory as to why the mini didn't have a tuner from the start.
GGJstudios
Mar 16, 04:59 PM
It this utter ignorance and false sense of security in the Mac user base that I would use to my advantage if I were a cyber-criminal.
It's neither ignorance nor a false sense of security. It's an awareness that virus threats don't exist and no antivirus can protect against something that doesn't exist.
I've seen more than enough evidence over the past few years to tell me that it's far from safe.
No OS is immune to malware, but it's impossible to protect yourself from something that does not yet exist.
The latest Safari/Webkit hacking contest result alone should be enough to cause any reasonable person to take notice.
Hacking a browser and creating a virus that can infect Mac OS X are two different animals.
I think a few people will be changing their tunes the day the crap finally hits the fan.
The day it "hits the fan", news sites and forums will be buzzing about the threat, making most Mac users aware. At that time a protection to the threat will be introduced. Only an extremely minute percentage of Mac users are likely to ever be infected, should that ever happen. Any antivirus apps installed today will be completely useless in defending against a newly-introduced virus, because they simply don't know what to look for.
It's neither ignorance nor a false sense of security. It's an awareness that virus threats don't exist and no antivirus can protect against something that doesn't exist.
I've seen more than enough evidence over the past few years to tell me that it's far from safe.
No OS is immune to malware, but it's impossible to protect yourself from something that does not yet exist.
The latest Safari/Webkit hacking contest result alone should be enough to cause any reasonable person to take notice.
Hacking a browser and creating a virus that can infect Mac OS X are two different animals.
I think a few people will be changing their tunes the day the crap finally hits the fan.
The day it "hits the fan", news sites and forums will be buzzing about the threat, making most Mac users aware. At that time a protection to the threat will be introduced. Only an extremely minute percentage of Mac users are likely to ever be infected, should that ever happen. Any antivirus apps installed today will be completely useless in defending against a newly-introduced virus, because they simply don't know what to look for.
Warbrain
Apr 20, 11:01 AM
Fail. It says I can withdraw by turning off location services. It still collects even though location services are turned off. Try again Applogist.
All I've seen is one paragraph claiming that. Until someone shows data from when location services was turned off it's hard to run with it.
Applogist? Jesus, that's such a sad bastardization of words. I'm trying to apply reasoning to this and have people understand that they've likely agreed to something because they don't read the ToS or SLA.
All I've seen is one paragraph claiming that. Until someone shows data from when location services was turned off it's hard to run with it.
Applogist? Jesus, that's such a sad bastardization of words. I'm trying to apply reasoning to this and have people understand that they've likely agreed to something because they don't read the ToS or SLA.
LagunaSol
Apr 4, 12:50 PM
I'm not a gun control advocate. I own a gun. But I laugh at the absurd notion of being a hero when threatened.
So, um...what are you going to do with your gun when threatened? :confused:
These glorified stories of what would have happened in situation X if someone had had a gun are laughable. It doesn't work like that.
How do you know?
So, um...what are you going to do with your gun when threatened? :confused:
These glorified stories of what would have happened in situation X if someone had had a gun are laughable. It doesn't work like that.
How do you know?
CDCC
Apr 19, 02:29 PM
Google probably have a kickass patent portfolio so they'll just countersue.
Google mostly makes Software. Apple has WAY more device and design patents.
Google mostly makes Software. Apple has WAY more device and design patents.
cmaier
Nov 14, 12:08 AM
Dude. You have a double standard. If Apple were to infringe on the copyright of someone else, you would be here pitchfork in hand screaming for blood.
If you look on other sites like macnn, you will see that the airfoil app does not only display Apple icons but rather the icon of whatever browser is configured as the main browser. They cannot make the claim that they have to right to use the Firefox, Camino or Omniweb icon in their app. It is not "streaming" the icon data, it is copied over and displayed superimposed on another icon which is presumably an internal OS X bundle. The audio is streamed but those icons are copied over and superimposed on each other on the phone. That is a clear violation of the IP of other programs in a manner that is not consistent with use on the mac it was pulled from.
Mozilla's trademark policy appears to allow this sort of use:
http://www.mozilla.org/foundation/trademarks/policy.html
More importantly, each of these companies is likely to argue for trademark infringement/unfair competition, not copyright infringement, particularly when the icon is trademarked (which is a different case than the Mac icons we are talking about).
It is permissible to use a trademark so long as there is no confusion as to source. That is, if people using the RA software are likely to think that somehow Mozilla (or the other companies) are the source of the software, this would be impermissible. It is permissible to use trademarks in a descriptive sense - i.e.: this icon means that the thing you are connecting to is the product Mozilla. There is also a fair use/non-trademark use defense. As long as the message I am sending is not "this product IS mozilla" it probably is not trademark infringement.
If you look on other sites like macnn, you will see that the airfoil app does not only display Apple icons but rather the icon of whatever browser is configured as the main browser. They cannot make the claim that they have to right to use the Firefox, Camino or Omniweb icon in their app. It is not "streaming" the icon data, it is copied over and displayed superimposed on another icon which is presumably an internal OS X bundle. The audio is streamed but those icons are copied over and superimposed on each other on the phone. That is a clear violation of the IP of other programs in a manner that is not consistent with use on the mac it was pulled from.
Mozilla's trademark policy appears to allow this sort of use:
http://www.mozilla.org/foundation/trademarks/policy.html
More importantly, each of these companies is likely to argue for trademark infringement/unfair competition, not copyright infringement, particularly when the icon is trademarked (which is a different case than the Mac icons we are talking about).
It is permissible to use a trademark so long as there is no confusion as to source. That is, if people using the RA software are likely to think that somehow Mozilla (or the other companies) are the source of the software, this would be impermissible. It is permissible to use trademarks in a descriptive sense - i.e.: this icon means that the thing you are connecting to is the product Mozilla. There is also a fair use/non-trademark use defense. As long as the message I am sending is not "this product IS mozilla" it probably is not trademark infringement.
balamw
Sep 21, 11:40 PM
Already I hear people grumbling that downloading these sub-DVD quality movies taking couple of hours even with high speed cable connections. HD quality would be about 6-8 times larger in file size and could take a day to download. Not sure if we are there yet...in terms of bandwidth.
Where do you get 6-8x 720p has only 3x the resolution and 1080i is just slightly higher than that. Only 1080p is 6-8x the raw resolution, but compression tends to work better if you give it more data to work with so birtates do not scale linearly with the number of pixels, and it can often be closer to a square root, so 720p might only be 2x as long as current movies with 1080p 3-4x.
B
Where do you get 6-8x 720p has only 3x the resolution and 1080i is just slightly higher than that. Only 1080p is 6-8x the raw resolution, but compression tends to work better if you give it more data to work with so birtates do not scale linearly with the number of pixels, and it can often be closer to a square root, so 720p might only be 2x as long as current movies with 1080p 3-4x.
B
corywoolf
Sep 5, 03:32 PM
Showtime is owned by Viacom,who also owns the movie channel and a cable company.
Who also owns the trademark "Mighty Mouse", which Apple licensed. I think he might be onto something. More then likely, the product is called "Showtime".
Who also owns the trademark "Mighty Mouse", which Apple licensed. I think he might be onto something. More then likely, the product is called "Showtime".
KingCrimson
Apr 19, 06:04 PM
Samsung can easily be replaced. Apple doesn't need them.
GFLPraxis
Mar 23, 04:57 PM
I think Apple's app-approval process is pretty arbitrary, so how much do they care about precedent in the first place? Apple giveth, and Apple taketh away. There is much bile spilled over it, but Apple's sales continue to soar.
I personally think passing around checkpoint info is protected under free speech. But, to repeat myself, anyone who is over the legal limit and uses an app to avoid a DUI is a selfish, irresponsible *******.
Agreed. But Trapster is primarily for speed traps, DUI traps is just a secondary function.
I personally think passing around checkpoint info is protected under free speech. But, to repeat myself, anyone who is over the legal limit and uses an app to avoid a DUI is a selfish, irresponsible *******.
Agreed. But Trapster is primarily for speed traps, DUI traps is just a secondary function.
howard
Sep 19, 02:37 PM
You can watch while downloading.
I was able to begin about 5 minutes into download -- barely enough time to get the snacks.
really? thats sweet! I'll have to tell my friends about that.
I havn't downloaded a movie yet, I'm still kinda in limbo about which direction to go... download, or wait for hd... or what?
we need a poll now for how many videos you have bought.
I was able to begin about 5 minutes into download -- barely enough time to get the snacks.
really? thats sweet! I'll have to tell my friends about that.
I havn't downloaded a movie yet, I'm still kinda in limbo about which direction to go... download, or wait for hd... or what?
we need a poll now for how many videos you have bought.
Mattie Num Nums
Apr 19, 09:01 AM
Android is a huge rip-off of the iPhone, that's obvious. Very early Android was more like a RIM or Symbian-looking thing and when the iPhone appeared it quickly started copying the heck out of that.
BUT - when the iPhone introduced the world to full touch screen phones, how else could someone make the same sort of device without it being a lot like an iPhone? Menus, icons, applications, grids... none of this is exactly new...
I can't stand Android and the layer of pointless fluff like HTC Sense that gets in your way with useless graphical nonsense and widgets. When I got a Desire after an iPhone 3G I thought I had a killer phone and 'got one over on the Apple tax' and would enjoy 'mulitasking' and 'openess'.
For five minutes.... Then I realised iOS is far more usable - even though the Desire was way faster with its 1gz processor much of the old iPhone 3G felt slicker. It makes sense not to have a layer of crap over the basic OS. It makes sense to ration multitasking so the phone doesn't bog down. Music playing on Android is rubbish. The iPhone dock is cool.
That's not to say everything on Android isn't good - in some cases auto text reflow would be GREAT on Safari.
Apple should just ignore the Android cloners and continue to innovate- and offer stripped down slickness as Android gets more and more overwrought.
You do realize that a bare bones Android OS looks nothing like iOS.
BUT - when the iPhone introduced the world to full touch screen phones, how else could someone make the same sort of device without it being a lot like an iPhone? Menus, icons, applications, grids... none of this is exactly new...
I can't stand Android and the layer of pointless fluff like HTC Sense that gets in your way with useless graphical nonsense and widgets. When I got a Desire after an iPhone 3G I thought I had a killer phone and 'got one over on the Apple tax' and would enjoy 'mulitasking' and 'openess'.
For five minutes.... Then I realised iOS is far more usable - even though the Desire was way faster with its 1gz processor much of the old iPhone 3G felt slicker. It makes sense not to have a layer of crap over the basic OS. It makes sense to ration multitasking so the phone doesn't bog down. Music playing on Android is rubbish. The iPhone dock is cool.
That's not to say everything on Android isn't good - in some cases auto text reflow would be GREAT on Safari.
Apple should just ignore the Android cloners and continue to innovate- and offer stripped down slickness as Android gets more and more overwrought.
You do realize that a bare bones Android OS looks nothing like iOS.
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